Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

A forum to air your views on Offaly GAA matters and beyond.
User avatar
Bord na Mona man
All Star
Posts: 4070
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:34 am
Club: Clara

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by Bord na Mona man »

I'd get all the players and management on a bus, load it up with cans, and head off somewhere for a two-day drinking session.
It might help restore team spirit and get them refocussed.

Anonymous1
All Star
Posts: 406
Joined: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:10 pm

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by Anonymous1 »

pigeon house biffo wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 8:38 pm
del wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 8:21 pm A recovery session took place not a training session . Meeting up in a pool for recovery is not gonna help us.
I’d be as pissed off as anyone about that london result. But realistically, regardless of the result, they were probably only ever going to get to train once this week with there being a game next weekend. For what its worth, I think the tone for this campaign has been set and no amount of running the sh1te out of lads in kilcormac is going to make a difference at this stage.
No but under Kearns or Maughan’s regime they’d do their slogging at training on a Tuesday or Wednesday and then more of a tactical session on the Friday night, one session after that drubbing is pitiful.

Anonymous1
All Star
Posts: 406
Joined: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:10 pm

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by Anonymous1 »

private joker wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 5:38 pm
joey1001 wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 4:26 pm
del wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 4:22 pm I think it’s time the MGT go whether there is not enough experience in the coaching set up but there is something seriously wrong . If this was any other manager the local press would be calling for his head .This is worse than when Stephen Wallace was there and he got the chop mid season . Time for the chairman to step in and do whats right for Offaly football and cut ties with this MGT enough damage has been done . The buck stops with the manager and in turn with the chairman

So just throw him out because we don't perform in one game?
It's not just one game. It was vs London who haven't won a game in 11 years who travelled to offaly and bet them by 14 points. It's also the under current of discontent that has been present all year.
Speaking of an under current of discontent, Anton played a full game for Rhode last night in the league despite not being named on the panel for the game against London.

There’s something seriously wrong there.

Anonymous1
All Star
Posts: 406
Joined: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:10 pm

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by Anonymous1 »

Lone Shark wrote: Tue May 14, 2024 1:31 pm I know that in my younger years I would have been baying for blood after a result like this, and there's still something deep down within me that's telling me that you can do all the nuanced analysis that you like, but you can't lose to London by 14 points and think that things are okay, clearly there are big, bright red flags waving.

Now it's rarely the right thing to act out of an emotional, visceral response, but I don't think it's over-reacting to say that there is a case to answer here, and what should be happening right now - and I assume is happening - is that questions are being asked as to how it has come to this, and what is happening to make sure that this kind of public humiliation doesn't happen again.

Just to be clear here, that's not meant as a dig at London because of who they are - I know Michael Maher (their manager) from playing ball with him in London, he's a passionate, genuine guy with an incredible coaching ability when it comes to skills, and he's working with decent players, albeit in a gig where there are logistical challenges that most managers would be unable to handle. I would say the same about this result if it happened against any team that has been in Division Four for a decent amount of time.

The stock in trade answers here are that this was a bump in the road, a setback, but the long term plan is still in place, yada yada yada. And to be honest, if I was to put a microphone in front of Declan Kelly and ask him the question for public consumption, then more than likely he's going to give some variant on that as an answer, and he'd be right to do so. This is not the time for Offaly senior football to start airing grievances and issues in public.

HOWEVER - if he was to offer a similar type of answer to Michael Duignan, Colm Cummins and company in a closed meeting at the Faithful Fields, then that would not be acceptable. If there isn't a very clear understanding of what combination of circumstances and events led to this result, then it's impossible to have confidence in DK as the right man to make sure it never happens again, and that it is just a blip. If the answer is that the players have downed tools - why? If they have lost faith in management and the systems and tactics in place, then what's going to change that?

There are a lot of reasons why DK is likely to hold onto the job into 2025. That there are questions over some of his choices with regards to Offaly's development squads is beyond doubt, and it'll be for the clubs to hold him to account there. But We're looking at a situation where there will be a new chairman in place for next year, and even if Offaly win the Joe McDonagh Cup, I imagine that Johnny Kelly's tenure is not certain to continue. If Offaly don't win that competition, I'd be stunned if he ends up staying on. So you'll probably have a vacancy there.

If there is a strong, concerted push from the players to remove him, it'll be very hard to go against that, but I don't know if I see that in the water. Firstly, this is a very young group, with a lot of inexperience. (Yes, that's in no small part because of Kelly's selection choices, but it's true all the same). For a group like that to put their weight behind a heave against an All-Ireland winning manager would leave them as hostages to fortune, since nationally, it would be seen as passing the buck.

It would be far easier for a handful of the more disgruntled players to just walk away, and while that doesn't suit Offaly in the sense that we need our best players on the training pitch, I think it's the more likely outcome than a coup.

That leaves the clubs, and nothing that I've seen from Offaly's clubs suggests to me that there are more than a handful on the football side that are sufficiently together and with their eyes on the bigger picture to take a strong view on this. What happened with this year's club championships - which look set to be an unmitigated disaster - is clear evidence of how we've gone back to the days of too many clubs sending the local ould lad who likes a chat into OCP as their club delegate, because the more energetic, driven people are needed back home looking after things like underage development, facilities and infrastructure, fundraising etc..


So what have I said there? Not much really, except that something is wrong, and I really hope that behind the scenes, they're able to figure out exactly what it is - because if the defence is a bombastic "I'm the gaffer", then we're in bigger trouble than we thought.
Two things on this;

1. Last year when it was widely accepted that the players downed tools on Martin Murphy in the Tailteann Cup it was obvious that he needed to be replaced even though he had going for him that he’d beaten both Longford and Meath in the championship and his players had been through an emotional rollercoaster of a year.

So why should it be any different for Kelly when objectively he’s overseen an even more disastrous set of results. For comparison we beat London 2-14 to 0-11 last year, fast forward 12 months and we’ve been beaten 2-20 to 0-12. That alone is a sackable offence imo.

2. Duignan’s term as chairman comes to an end later this year but the decision on who manages us in 2025 will need to be taken long before he departs so it will be in his gift whether to stick or twist and given the fact he shoved Murphy aside for Kelly, they’re now joined at the hip. If Kelly fails so does part of Duignan’s legacy so for that reason you’d think Duignan will do all he can to keep Kelly but I can’t imagine the majority of players will want to come back into the same regime again next year and we could see an exodus of players if so.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

ruletheroost
Junior B
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue May 14, 2024 11:37 am

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by ruletheroost »

Anonymous1 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 1:14 am
private joker wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 5:38 pm
joey1001 wrote: Mon May 13, 2024 4:26 pm


So just throw him out because we don't perform in one game?
It's not just one game. It was vs London who haven't won a game in 11 years who travelled to offaly and bet them by 14 points. It's also the under current of discontent that has been present all year.
Speaking of an under current of discontent, Anton played a full game for Rhode last night in the league despite not being named on the panel for the game against London.

There’s something seriously wrong there.
Anton was declared fit for the London game but was told he wasn’t part of the plans for London.
There is uproar in that camp there is no doubt. Senior players want DK gone.

They had a recovery session Sunday morning and a couple of extra players were brought in. I’m not sure DK knows what an inter county player should look like when I heard who was brought in.

Tmacmahon
All Star
Posts: 170
Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2019 2:28 pm
Club: Ferbane

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by Tmacmahon »

Should DK stay or go in a word?

joey1001
All Star
Posts: 223
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2024 11:11 am

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by joey1001 »

Tmacmahon wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 7:30 am Should DK stay or go in a word?
Well since so many good candidates on here who know how to train a team and have the inside line already on the camp then he has to go, needs to be replaced before Saturday so new manager can get a good hard slog of a session in before limerick 🤣 I never heard so many rumours and nonsense, Kelly should and will absolutely stay and will be successful with this team over the next few years. If you think he " rules with an iron fist" then we'd be sacking Jim mcguiness after a week. I don't know Kelly but he won an u20 all Ireland and he clearly has a good relationship with vast majority of players. Maybe it's not him that's the problem? Players aren't ",downing tools" as a protest against the manager nor did they do it last year , they didn't show up and apply themselves after leinster. I bet if we were thrown into one of the groups in the all Ireland series, you'd see a different team. Maybe it's a mental block with the players, the team and the county in general. I heard Anton had a burger and a coke zero after the rhode match so he had to go 😋 the sad part is that a lot of lads will want to see 2 defeats in the last 2 games so Kelly will be ousted.

ruletheroost
Junior B
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue May 14, 2024 11:37 am

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by ruletheroost »

joey1001 wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 8:22 am
Tmacmahon wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 7:30 am Should DK stay or go in a word?
Well since so many good candidates on here who know how to train a team and have the inside line already on the camp then he has to go, needs to be replaced before Saturday so new manager can get a good hard slog of a session in before limerick 🤣 I never heard so many rumours and nonsense, Kelly should and will absolutely stay and will be successful with this team over the next few years. If you think he " rules with an iron fist" then we'd be sacking Jim mcguiness after a week. I don't know Kelly but he won an u20 all Ireland and he clearly has a good relationship with vast majority of players. Maybe it's not him that's the problem? Players aren't ",downing tools" as a protest against the manager nor did they do it last year , they didn't show up and apply themselves after leinster. I bet if we were thrown into one of the groups in the all Ireland series, you'd see a different team. Maybe it's a mental block with the players, the team and the county in general. I heard Anton had a burger and a coke zero after the rhode match so he had to go 😋 the sad part is that a lot of lads will want to see 2 defeats in the last 2 games so Kelly will be ousted.
The difference with Jim Mcguinness is he formed leadership groups within the panel. Those players would go through a wall for him. A couple of leaders went to DK early doors with ideas on S&C and where they thought they needed to be. They were told in no uncertain terms to get back in their box.

There is a huge difference between setting out standards and goals and getting a buy in from everyone to telling a group it's my way or the highway. It doesn't work.

SearingDrive
All Star
Posts: 1227
Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2008 10:00 pm

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by SearingDrive »

Tmacmahon wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 7:30 am Should DK stay or go in a word?
Yes stay.

Doon Exile
All Star
Posts: 314
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 2:03 pm
Location: up in the air

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by Doon Exile »

SearingDrive wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 1:13 pm
Tmacmahon wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 7:30 am Should DK stay or go in a word?
Yes stay.
Stay
Doon exile....

ruletheroost
Junior B
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue May 14, 2024 11:37 am

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by ruletheroost »

Tmacmahon wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 7:30 am Should DK stay or go in a word?
Go!

jimbob17
All Star
Posts: 938
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:40 am

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by jimbob17 »

Tmacmahon wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 7:30 am Should DK stay or go in a word?
Don't believe it is as simplistic as that. If I were asked, it'd depend on a few things

1. who was there with him in management.
2. the confidence level of players in manager.
3. makeup of backroom team and use of S&C best practices.
4. willingness to step aside from underage development role.

If he has lost the players or dressing room to such a degree that players will not return under his reign, it is a definite NO.

If the managerial status quo remains with same personnel, it is a definite NO.

The senior managers role and development role are way too important for whoever is doing them to have half an eye on one or other at same time. No other county has a senior manager doing both roles. He needs to step away from underage dev if doing senior managers job. There have been issues pointed out in other threads re underage and it isnt healthy or right for organisation for one person to be so immersed in both roles.

If there are conversations with player representative group around fixing any issues and they get acknowledged to degree that players are willing to come back in and work at it, then it can be a yes.

It was stated above here that there were issues around S&C etc. I certainly don't have full picture on what went on there but there is clearly something amiss. I am not fully up to speed on this area but if this gets in any way ignored, then we are on back foot and won't compete to potential.

Also, the last thing a manager needs are YES men around him. If the coaches or selectors are not at the standard in terms of knowledge or know how for any reason, then they need to go and people with experience, know how or acumen need to be brought in. The best managers surround themselves with people that know more than they do in their respective areas and then delegate them to do their work. If that isn't happening, then we are at a loss straight away. And by the way, I am not at all saying the selectors / coaching / backroom is in any way at fault here but there is reference to it above by people who seem to know more than I do about what went on.

So in a word (or two), it depends......

on resolving any outstanding issues to satisfactory levels so that we can get our best players on the pitch playing for each other and the manager. If it is resolvable, there is a chance. If the player / manager relationship is broken to such a degree that it is irretrievable, then he needs to step away. Only those involved (players and management) know the real truth and I think the co board need to sit down with both when year is over to establish the feelings of both and let them do their job and make a judgement call from there.
jimbob

Faithful follower
Junior B
Posts: 19
Joined: Sun Apr 01, 2018 5:52 pm
Club: Dublin

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by Faithful follower »

There no doubt we have a problem with Offaly senior football, what ever went wrong with having to be sorted and if it turns out that management made a mistake with preparation for the London game they need to hold their hand up and say so . The Offaly gaa people will be tolerant and acceptant . It’s my opinion that the team may have been overtrained and were suffering from fatigue, I have seen signs of this in earlier games and I wonder is is a simple as that . Our game against Laois was something special this year our boys were on fire and the had a real spark about their play and it looked like this team had turned a corner, with the dry conditions and open ground our boys cut loose and played some lovely football granted Laois were poor that day and they closed the gap before Offaly pulled away with some style. If there is any one on here that really thinks that our Offaly boys were bothered in Tullamore last weekend you need a reality check, every Offaly player would dream of having the game of his life in front of his home supporters , people need to be honest here do you think that our boys are putting in the very hard yards 4/5 times a week and then when a big occasion to play in front of home supporters they just don’t bother. There’s is a reason but it’s not apathy . Its easy to support a winning team so we need to dig deep for our boys. The setup in Offaly is not fit for purpose for supplying county players to the senior county team and this is the main reason why Offaly are struggling. So let’s honourably here and don’t pretend that the players don’t give a rats arse.

ah lethimoutwithit
All Star
Posts: 450
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2014 2:46 pm

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by ah lethimoutwithit »

Faithful follower wrote: Wed May 15, 2024 6:38 pm There no doubt we have a problem with Offaly senior football, what ever went wrong with having to be sorted and if it turns out that management made a mistake with preparation for the London game they need to hold their hand up and say so . The Offaly gaa people will be tolerant and acceptant . It’s my opinion that the team may have been overtrained and were suffering from fatigue, I have seen signs of this in earlier games and I wonder is is a simple as that . Our game against Laois was something special this year our boys were on fire and the had a real spark about their play and it looked like this team had turned a corner, with the dry conditions and open ground our boys cut loose and played some lovely football granted Laois were poor that day and they closed the gap before Offaly pulled away with some style. If there is any one on here that really thinks that our Offaly boys were bothered in Tullamore last weekend you need a reality check, every Offaly player would dream of having the game of his life in front of his home supporters , people need to be honest here do you think that our boys are putting in the very hard yards 4/5 times a week and then when a big occasion to play in front of home supporters they just don’t bother. There’s is a reason but it’s not apathy . Its easy to support a winning team so we need to dig deep for our boys. The setup in Offaly is not fit for purpose for supplying county players to the senior county team and this is the main reason why Offaly are struggling. So let’s honourably here and don’t pretend that the players don’t give a rats arse.

I think this is a sensible point here.
My view is that there are a number of senior players (not a big number), but from senior clubs in the county who probably felt that Declan Kelly was not a big enough name and have tried to push the boundaries and found that they ain't calling the shots like they are used to. Declan Kelly deserved a cut at the job, based on his fantastic club record alone, and will no doubt have learned a lot in this (his) first year at this level. We have hung plenty of managers out to dry over the years, and whilst I don't agree with all of Declan's choices, I will say that no way should he be sacrificed for what was a disgraceful performance by the players! No way.
But, there are issues with some players, and either they man up and sit down with Declan Kelly and his management team, or bugger off. We've had too many average players held up here from time to time as if they were All Stars.

I would also hazard a guess that there are many firing comments here "Dads" and "Mums" of development squad players and are taking cheap shots.
The commentary around Declan Kelly has been pretty bad, and completely unfair to a guy who has put a savage effort into the GAA from a young age and has battled coming from a small club. Yes, he has made errors, but he deserves a chance and it is up to the group to tackle Limerick like this is a battle to stay up.
My final point is, and this is not a short term fix, but the standard of coaching in clubs at underage level and in schools is pretty poor. This is feeding into the system and we are all reaping what is being sown. I stated this a few weeks ago , probably in this thread and named club coaches. Very little response to that, and I wonder how much of the commentary here or elsewhere is coming from guys, girls, that never coached at all , never mind at adult level.
I would hazard a guess that Declan Kelly would be backed by a lot more than want him to go amongst the general GAA public, and players and we do know how difficult a task it is.
Doubt he's reading this , or the players, but would say to them all, time to circle the wagons lads and get out a do it for yerselves against Limerick. I wish ye well in your efforts, but once the effort is put in thats all we can ask for.

Best of luck on Saturday and By Jaysus, if i was young enough and good enough to play, the very fact that these JP goons are dragging us to Rathkeale would be enough motivation to win.

One Time
Junior C
Posts: 6
Joined: Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:50 am

Re: Offaly Senior Footballers 2024

Post by One Time »

Will be heading to limerick tomorrow to see what hopefully can be the start of a revival.. Sadly The heroes of 21 unfortunately have become the villians of 24, its harsh in a way but players ultimately will be judged on how they perform at the top level. Often heard it said "what ever happened to such and such, wasn't he on that u21 team, where did he go" I don't get to go to many matches these days but by all accounts we didn't show up at all against London and if you're not at it and not tuned in, you can get beaten and these kinda things can happen although it is certainly not excuseble. I got to a couple league games this year and we seemed to play some very good football at times when we got it together.. in particular against clare and wicklow.. the limerick game was one I was at, a strange game and I don't think tomorrow will be anything like it, we were poor and had to battle after starting a bit on the back foot but dominating most of the game.. limerick are poor enough and if we are switched on from the start and go at it and get on the front foot we can come out with a 6/7 point win, if we don't then we could lose by the same margin.. I'm heading to this match and have mapped out my plans to go to all the matches in the TC, at least that way if we win it I can look back and say I saw it, apart from the London game and that wasnt pretty viewing anyway.. Under no illusions we need a revival and even at that, there are some very strong teams in there Down, Sligo, Fermanagh and kildare in particular with the latter now finding themselves again. Offalys ambition has to be to try win a tailteann cup, has to be our aim and promotion from division 3 gettin the chance the compete against the top teams. Let's hope the team and the county can start to embrace what is our level and our all ireland now. Nothin against Rathkeale but why is it there? Anywau Best of luck to the lads tomorrow.

Post Reply